Ok I'm lost then, unless we take Ozzman's definition of hardcore as realistic shooters I'm struggling to see what is hardcore. Online multiplayer ? Ok anyone up for some hardcore Animal Crossing ? :) All those FF / MGS players are going to be shocked to find out after 80+ hours that they are casual now. My point is that articles like this one (and many others) all seem to arbitrarily decide what hardcore is, consider it to be something that family friendly Nintendo (or Sega for that matter) has never done, then jump up and down on Nintendo for not caring about hardcore any more. Hardcore seems to be whatever I decide it is in order to prove you don't do it (or at least not as well as I do).

I always love these discussions on "Hardcore" gaming but I always come back to the same thing. Given I've been playing computer/console games for over 20 years now at some point I must have stopped paying attention, when exactly did some smug elitist git decide Mario, Zelda , Sonic etc games weren't "Hardcore" anymore ? I seem to remember when those games were the industry. When did the 3d maze derivatives become all that mattered ?